Curse

DarkzCloudz · May 25, 2005, 03:04 AM // 03:04

Remember how when everyone reached lvl 20, they all complained and then it was said this was only for the beta. Remember how when u got to lvl 20, u didnt move on at all? Remember how in the beta, you expected the level cap to raise on full version. Remember how fast it takes to get to level 20? Remember how there is only 5 armor sets in the whole game? Or how every type of item has a few sets with only pre and suffixes to seperate them from one another?

Remember how for awhile you thought "yeah lvl 20 cap now for 5 months until expansion to raise it by 5 levels", or how about "yeah after the beta they will probably have a ton of different armors and cool weapons", etc.

I remember it, and now.... Well, lets just say the only hope that me.. and A LOT of other people have to play and go on is that the games young and that the game will get out of this sort of beta-like stage when it comes to the levels, the items, and the overall game itself.

This was written after taking a full day of interviewing people on GW. I know, you old players say "pvp is enough to keep you interested and lvl 20 is a good balance", but that's not the nature for games like this.

Aaaaagh · May 25, 2005, 03:17 AM // 03:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by DarkzCloudz

This was written after taking a full day of interviewing people on GW. I know, you old players say "pvp is enough to keep you interested and lvl 20 is a good balance", but that's not the nature for games like this.

The nature of games like this....well to the best of my (exquisite and superior!) knowledge this is the first game like this. By saying "nature of games like this" your comparing. But there is nothing to compare to. This is a game designed for the casual gamer. Its not Evercrack, you arent meant to forego all other life and devote yourself eternally to "The Guild Wars Experience."

For fiddy dollars this game is a crazy deal, many hours of enjoyment for pennies per hour.

rook818 · May 25, 2005, 03:24 AM // 03:24

Well, as a single player game they've succeeded brilliantly. The game is pretty, fun, and time consuming....but there is one glaring problem. It's not supposed to be a single player game. The problem is there isn't enough content for it to compete against an MMO and it suffers from the same ailment of all single player games. It has an ending (granted you could go on). It can leave you with the feeling of, "ok, conquered it, time to move on". It'll be interesting to see how (or if) they combat this.

Axehilt · May 25, 2005, 03:31 AM // 03:31

I agree with Aaaagh. This is no leveling treadmill game. If performing mindless repetitive tasks to inexorably level your character to level 1 billion is your idea of fun, then you're playing the wrong game.

If you want a PVP-oriented game where skill and strategy are more important than other MMORPGs, play Guild Wars.

Level 20 isn't "balance" necessarily - they could've chosen any number to stop leveling at and as long as you were still forced to specialize to remain competitive everything would still be balanced. Level 20 was just a natural 'flow' to levelling throughout the PVE experience - not levelling too quickly and not levelling too slowly.

PhineasToke · May 25, 2005, 03:41 AM // 03:41

Quote:

This is a game designed for the casual gamer.

I couldn't have said it better myself. If power leveling and endless magic find runs are more to your liking, this isn't the game. The game is ONE MONTH OLD since release. I think giving the developers a chance is worth the wait.

Mallich · May 25, 2005, 03:51 AM // 03:51

Ok, first of all, Guild Wars was not meant to be the MMORPG to dominate all the other ones, for the thousandth time there is a reason they call it a CORPG.

Level 20 has ALWAYS been the cap, ANET has stuck by this. The "RP" part of the game is meant to be based on skill where it's more about having a good build and working well in a team rather than being a higher level, as not all level 20 characters are created equal. They will of course be adding more missions with each expansion pack, and they've said that they're designing it for the level 20 characters since it's not incredibly challenging to get to level 20.

Second of all Guild Wars is really more of a PvP game than anything else, and once again it's not meant to be the standard MMORPG PvP like DaoC or Shadowbane or maybe even World of Warcraft. It's meant to be based around build design and team design/teamwork. For this goal the level 20 cap works quite nicely in my opinion.

ANET isn't charging per month on this game. This game has a target audience, just as every other game does, it's not meant for grinding. Personally I sometimes like grinding, although I'm very happy to get rid of it for a while. This is why I play Guild Wars. If you like the single player but get bored with it after a while, remember that your still only paying $50 for a game that you probably still spend at least 70 hours on, and that's if you only level one character to 20. Most games these days, save MMORPGs, which once again this isn't trying to replicate, don't get anywhere near that. Take a break from it if you want, you can come back whenever, maybe you'll decide you like the expansion pack.

DrSLUGFly · May 25, 2005, 03:52 AM // 03:52

I like this game... I also like to say the name Aaaaagh. I'm almost at level 20 and I'm disappointed, partially because I want to be stronger (but that's my attribute cap not my level cap) but mostly because I still want the feeling of progression...

But I"m not really worried about it. Although I do wish there were more options for armor and weapons, and I also wish it wasn't as simple as just looking at the numbers to find good armor. I'd like for style to play a larger part, I'd like for armor that is higher perhaps to have a higher visibility rating also (attract creeps sooner) and maybe lower armor have a lower vis. rating (get closer without pulling)...

These are just two examples, but one problem I have with nearly EVERY game is that in the end it all comes down to just looking at the numbers and everyone ends up with the same items for their class and in many cases ends up with the same class (ie. D2=sorc, GW=W/M... or so I've seen it complained about)

westwood · May 25, 2005, 04:17 AM // 04:17

for me this game has the same draw CS has. the competitive play from leagues is incredibly enjoyable for me. especially when you reach the high end-gaming. so far ive been impressed, hopefully GW will have the staying power im looking for.

Axehilt · May 25, 2005, 10:11 AM // 10:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by westwood

for me this game has the same draw CS has. the competitive play from leagues is incredibly enjoyable for me. especially when you reach the high end-gaming. so far ive been impressed, hopefully GW will have the staying power im looking for.

Exactly! A more competitive MMORPG doesn't exist. Despite that, it's apparent that most people think GW is easy enough for casual gamers to get into - obviously a sign that the designers of the game know their stuff, since the ideal game design follows the old adage, "simple to learn, a lifetime to master."

I'm really glad that the two major skill-reducing aspects of other MMORPG PVP (namely Time Spent Playing and More Players Than You) aren't present in GW. No longer can you win simply because you logged 1030 hours and descended into the Depths of Eternal Despair to get that Long Sword +34 from the Ancient Bugblatter Beast. No longer can you simply mass up more players in your raid than your enemy, and win a battle simply through force of numbers. In GW you actually have to be a solid player working well in a team.

Cragz · May 25, 2005, 10:19 AM // 10:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by DarkzCloudz

Remember how...

No, I don't remember any of that, as people who actually knew the slightest thing about Guild Wars in beta knew none of it would ever happen. How about this:

Remember how ArenaNet designed the game for quick levelling into hard PvP?
Remember how the endgame is almost exclusively PvP?
Remember how this is supposed to be nothing like a traditional MMORPG?

Of course you don't, 'cause you seem to have completely missed the point.

[edit] Of course, these all come with disclaimers. Whilst the game is in essence a lot quicker to endgame than the majority of MMORPGs it still contains heartbreaking amounts of grind. [/edit]

Oracle · May 25, 2005, 10:48 AM // 10:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by DarkzCloudz

Remember how in the beta, you expected the level cap to raise on full version.

No serious follower of this game expected there to be a rise in the level cap, because Jeff Strain was asked about that eons ago and said there wouldn't be one, though they didn't rule it out totally for future expansions (which I read as being a 'standard disclaimer' anyway, as nobody can predict how the game will change years into the future so he didn't want to make a 100% binding statement like "there will NEVER be a rise in level cap").

Quote:

Originally Posted by DarkzCloudz

I remember it, and now.... Well, lets just say the only hope that me.. and A LOT of other people have to play and go on is that the games young and that the game will get out of this sort of beta-like stage when it comes to the levels, the items, and the overall game itself.

I can only assume "A LOT" of the people you talked to didn't know what to expect from this game. Everything I read in your post makes me think this is just another "this isn't enough like other MMORPGS out there *cough* WoW *cough*" thread. Sorry if that sounds harsh, but it's how it reads.

Quote:

Originally Posted by DarkzCloudz

This was written after taking a full day of interviewing people on GW.

I followed this game since WPE (October 2004) and I can in total honesty say that I'm not bored of it. It's not the 'anti-climax' that I found WoW to be (I'm still paying the EU subscription to it and play it occasionally). Everyone is entitled to their opinions, but please don't kid yourself that your opinion is that of 'the majority' - because it certainly isn't.

Quote:

Originally Posted by DarkzCloudz

I know, you old players say "pvp is enough to keep you interested and lvl 20 is a good balance", but that's not the nature for games like this.

This isn't like other games, and more importantly it isn't trying to be like those other games; you appear to want something that the game never pretended to offer. I can only re-iterate what the previous poster said:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cragz

Remember how this is supposed to be nothing like a traditional MMORPG?

Thus, you are disillusioned because you had false expectations.

You've paid a one-off cost for this game and I think you'll get great value for money from it. If you want an immensely immersive 'traditional' MMORPG with 1,000+ hours of storyline (and thousands of items, crafting, questing, high levels, etc,) then I would totally agree that this game will not provide that. But if you want amazing PvP with a perfectly good and enjoyable PvE prequel, this game will not disappoint.

Cragz · May 25, 2005, 11:06 AM // 11:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by Oracle

Thus, you are disillusioned because you had false expectations.

If you can't generate false expectations via months of beta testing an utterly outstanding game, when can you?

[sly edit] I'm assuming the comment was aimed at me

[/edit]

Ninna · May 25, 2005, 11:44 AM // 11:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by Oracle

I can in total honesty say that I'm not bored of it. It's not the 'anti-climax' that I found WoW to be

fully agree

for all those that say higher level caps makes games better

WoW has a level 60 cap and is a much more boring (at 60) than Guild Wars is at level 20

higher level caps do not make games more exciting

CONTENT / gameplay does

MMOGuy · May 25, 2005, 01:56 PM // 13:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by DarkzCloudz

Remember how when everyone reached lvl 20, they all complained and then it was said this was only for the beta. Remember how when u got to lvl 20, u didnt move on at all? Remember how in the beta, you expected the level cap to raise on full version. Remember how fast it takes to get to level 20? Remember how there is only 5 armor sets in the whole game? Or how every type of item has a few sets with only pre and suffixes to seperate them from one another?

Remember how for awhile you thought "yeah lvl 20 cap now for 5 months until expansion to raise it by 5 levels", or how about "yeah after the beta they will probably have a ton of different armors and cool weapons", etc.

I remember it, and now.... Well, lets just say the only hope that me.. and A LOT of other people have to play and go on is that the games young and that the game will get out of this sort of beta-like stage when it comes to the levels, the items, and the overall game itself.

This was written after taking a full day of interviewing people on GW. I know, you old players say "pvp is enough to keep you interested and lvl 20 is a good balance", but that's not the nature for games like this.

There are no other "games like this", and thats why its so good. If you want your precious grind with uber items, go play WoW and stop cluttering up these forums, toolbag.

Ramus · May 25, 2005, 02:23 PM // 14:23

I do not think it needs more levels, but it will need something to make people want to do the extra chapters and want to go the extra mile through new missions and quests. What will be the point of questing in chapter 2? Certainly the quests we have now are worthless except for experience. What will be the point of doing missions if it will not effect our characters at all? This is the only thing I worry about. Everyone gets all defensive about not wanting a grind, but no one gets defensive about playing the game with no reward. Im a goal oriented gamer, and I hope I do not run out of goals!

Shamblemonkee · May 25, 2005, 02:49 PM // 14:49

According to the gW site FAQ new chapters are likely to include new skills - apparently we should be thinking of chapters as like adding a new deck to a Magic the Gathering set (I've not played M:TG though) - new races and new items in addition to extra areas and quests.

piercehead · May 25, 2005, 03:14 PM // 15:14

The main thing I'm hoping to get from the next expansion is a race or two more to play.
Hopefully not TOO many new skills etc, just a few tweaks here and there of course.

Ninna · May 25, 2005, 04:40 PM // 16:40

they have hinted at new professions too

Future expansions
http://www.guildwars.com/faq/default.html#release

Quote:

Yes. Purchasing the newer chapters of Guild Wars will not make you strictly more powerful. You will have access to many more strategic options, due to the expanding nature of the skills, abilities, items and professions that you enjoy with each chapter.

It would be similar to building a deck in Magic: The Gathering™: The more cards you own, the more different playing decks that you can choose from to use in the game.

When you buy the chapters of Guild Wars, you will acquire a larger collection of skills and abilities from which to build your skill set, but you will not gain more power. So if you purchase a chapter and your friend does not, you will still be able to play competitively against and with one another.